After Land Rover and Nissan and now Honda are pulling out of the country! I assume Jaguar are planning and it will be only a matter of time before BWM want to build Mini outside UK. It is looking very bleak for the car industry. Infact, probably many more manufacturer (Dyson, INEOS to just name two) will likely follow suit. I know one will argue BREXIT would only mean a temporary pain and disruption. unfortunately, this could be only the start of the worse to come...and who said BREXIT is great for our country?!
Replies
What's a BWM?
posted by The Arizonan - Monday 18th February 2019, 2:41 PM
The majority.
posted by Will (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 2:42 PM
Get up to speed! Dyson havent manufactured in the UK for ages. They manufacture in Malaysia, which is why they like a tanking UK currency as they earn in dollars and convert back to sterling. Brexit is a catastrophe for the Bristish economy but great for bigots, xénophobes and Little Englanders, who believe we still have an Empire, or, at least, should have
posted by Rm (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:05 PM
Land rover sales are down because seventy percent of the cars are diesels. Snowflakes again. Others are just warnings they might pull out. It will cost them millions to set up some where else. People voted to come out because the so called people running this country GOT IT BADLY WRONG. And people had' had enough of there s###t. And they are still GETTING IT WRONG.
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:10 PM
Yes, Geezer, they sure are getting it wrong. However, that doesnt mean we should all punch ourselves in the face. We are hitting out at the wrong people; screwing the economy will only make it worse
posted by Rm (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:12 PM
PS Landrover and jags are the same company. And BOB marley and the wailers [BMW]. England is there biggest buyers.
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:18 PM
The bell ends have had two years to get it sorted. Why its taking so long is because they have to see that they are well and truly sorted out first.
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:24 PM
if they pull out, stop buying their products! how many will do that I wonder
posted by doom (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:32 PM
Unless politicians start telling the truth about the dependence on our close relationship with the EU nothing will get sorted. The reason its taken so long is that its only now that we are facing a deadline that its becoming apparent that you cannot square a circle and that Brexit was one big fat lie ( or lots of big fat lies)
posted by Rm (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 3:32 PM
Rm- Totally agree, well said
posted by Keetch54 - Monday 18th February 2019, 4:29 PM
Im quite close to land rover and can assure you the new plant just opened in the czech area could do away with solihull and other plants in uk. Airbus in ukis also in for a killing.unfortunately these are the things the polititians didnt warn you.Also ba can no longer be majority shareholders of IAG,hence they will stop controlling aer lingus. Iberia....fly the flag.
posted by T.no (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 5:24 PM
Your quite correct many lies were told during the run up to the referendum, I clearly remember being told that if we voted to leave we would have to have an emergency budget - never happened, unemployment would rise- just the opposite, the economy would crash - no sign of it, America would put us at the end of the queue for any trade deals, the man in charge says we won't
I suppose the plague of locusts could still happen !!!
Oh yee of little faith
posted by John (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 5:31 PM
Geezer not sure why you think li'l old blighty is BMW's biggest market. Take a trip to Germany, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Russia, etc., etc. There are more BMW's on the autobahn than there are in the UK!!
Brexit was always going to lead to major job losses and anybody who thinks otherwise is simply incorrect. That is not an opinion it is a simple fact. One airline gone blaming Brexit, one car manufacturer doing the same, Sunderland will be next, then Derby, then, then then.
Sterling is volatile and been under pressure for some time and how long do you thing the economy will grow (if you think sub 1% is growth!!)once it is £0.90 to the euro and equal with the USD which is not just possible but likely if we leave without a deal.
The minimum duties that most analysts are predicting is 4% but maybe as much 8% for some goods. If sterling drops by 10% it doesn't take a mathematician to work out that the economy could shrink by up to 5% and if you think there are a lot of foodbanks now wait 'til then!
That's what happens when you give people who don't know what they're voting for a vote unfortunately :0(((.
posted by MST (Moderator) - Monday 18th February 2019, 5:52 PM
We are in a transition from oil to electrics. Companies like Landrover just haven't kept up with the times. The Germans have progressed starting small. Volkswagen up is 'E' The Golf is a 'E' BMW is a 'E' We will blame Brexit for most of our problems when Brexit has not even breathed in yet.
Away from cars, new deals can be negotiated no problem. We will have new deals with America, China, the swiss ect. Half of Europe are skint anyway and i suspect that when we leave, others will follow.
posted by OWEN (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 5:56 PM
Owen, when we leave the EU we will leave behind over 30 trade deals with countries outside the EU that the EU negotiated on our behalf as well as trade deals with all the EU countries. It has taken 30+ months to negotiate an exit from the EU and we are still nowhere near agreeing a final plan, how long do you think it will take to negotiate new deals with other countries? It isn't happening overnight mate as if by magic like some people (including you) seem to think) and in the meantime what do you think will happen?
Chaos but don't worry most people who contribute to this board won't be around to see it so all's well..........Sigh!!
posted by MST (Moderator) - Monday 18th February 2019, 6:14 PM
MST about BMW it has been in the Times about it. And as you say its all about predictions. which dont mean nothing. Just like percentages in a game of football. And to be quite honest its just like whats going on at Fulham its all behind closed doors. But if they get it wrong politics in this county will never be the same again.
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 6:19 PM
If it was in a newspaper then it must be right (to be read in a sarcastic tone) ;0)). Suggest you have a look on their corporate website ;0)).
posted by MST (Moderator) - Monday 18th February 2019, 6:25 PM
Bob Marley and the Wailers - thanks Geezer. Marley'd gone but seems like the wailers are posting on this thread in droves.
posted by The Arizonan - Monday 18th February 2019, 6:48 PM
MMST i think we are the largest overseas market
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 7:24 PM
The beech trees on here should stick to football where their reactionary views are almost amusing. Face it, England is little. We'll soon find out when we're on our own.
posted by The troll (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 11:15 PM
*brexiteers
posted by The troll (Guest) - Monday 18th February 2019, 11:16 PM
Why is it that every time a company announces bad news everyone relates it to brexit?
27 members only 3 holding there heads above water it’s a no brainier for me.
Times are changing rapidly
posted by Mike (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 7:05 AM
"Nicholas Shaxson" The Financial Curse Good read.
posted by Reader (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 8:10 AM
The country is falling apart as a result of the Brexit!! Parliament is a mess. The political parties are a mess! The Brexit deal is a mess! The manufacturer industry is a mess! High street, albeit nothing to do with Brexit, is a mess! You don’t hear much about banks affected by brexit because they have all moved their accounting and bookings out of UK as a result of the Brexit - that’s not a mess but a complete disaster for our financial center of the world! We are five weeks away from leaving the complete situation is a mess! Honda moving out is the least of my worry for my kids!
posted by John (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 8:11 AM
England forever, EU for never. You lot posting in favour of being in then EU, want your heads testing. They are the most crooked lot of 27 nations that could ever be assembled, and the auditors won't even sign of their accounts as they have more fiddlers than an orchestra. We will go on to be a great nation again once we are out, with our own laws, fishing rights etc, and we won't be handing over billions of pounds to a load of crooks that hate us, as proved every year in the Eurovision song contest. If you all love the EU so much, go and live in Europe, but you will soon be hurrying back, once you see how well we are doing on our own.
posted by LTS (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 8:40 AM
I think some of you have lost sight of the fact that the "billions of pounds" we pay to the EU offsets the "TRILLIONS OF POUNDS"" we (you, I, businesses and ultimately you and I) will pay in duty when we are no longer part of the EU.
The reason Honda are leaving is because the EU and Japan have struck a free trade agreement which, means that they no longer have to manufacture in the EU and if they stay in the UK they will be subject to duty when they ship into the EU. It's a no brainer for a business.
Naively, quoting the Eurovision Song Contest LTS once again compounds my argument that if you give someone a vote that does not know what they are voting for, you end up in a mess like the one we have.
You should also remember how many people in this country are employed by European companies; who do you think owns our utilities? EDF - France, eON - Germany, NPower - Germany, etc., etc., etc. Where do you think our food comes from? Even Cadbury's chocolate is imported from Poland.
You Brexiteers have no idea what you have doe to this country and most of you won't even live to see the legacy you've left for your children and grandchildren. It's enough to make you want to cry :0(((.
posted by MST (Moderator) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 8:53 AM
Owe dear MST, still spouting the same nonsense about brexit!!!
The truth is no one really knows what will happen or what shape brexit will yet take, yet you remainders know everything according to you.
Have you not not noticed how the press report good articles saying inspite of brexit new jobs created, and then in the next article it will be because of brexit jobs closing.
You might also want to do some research into who owns various news outfits such as the Guardian, Huffpost, the independent I could go on.
And just just to prove a small point the bbc ran a article on the front of there website saying that the ftse has suffered a dip the dip was 0.05% yet the previous week the ftse has gained a whole 2% yet nothing on any of the news outfits go work that one out.
posted by Snowflake tormentor (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:16 AM
MST - Head / Wall / Smash
You are wasting your time.
posted by Keetch54 - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:21 AM
Snowflake - yes no one know for certain what will happen. But tell me one good thing happen since 2016? All the mess above. Nhs have no staff. Pounds have dropped 15% - make the country weaker globally. Etc etc. Perhaps once we left Eu things by magic will change for the better. In that respect I hope you are right and I am wrong! But am not sure and seen no evidence yet!
posted by John (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:22 AM
I know Keetch. What gets me as there are people like ST above who are relying on news beats from the media they mention and all the time assuming that's the same for everyone when actually some of us actually work in business and are seeing the issues firsthand. Again, give someone a vote who does not know what they are voting for.....
posted by MST (Moderator) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:24 AM
Keetch54, sadly your comment just proves my point, you aren’t able to deflate with any factually evidence you just say the same thing over and over again.
John, thank you for your reply as you at least put some comments forward to discuss. With regards to the NHS have no staff , there has always been a shortage of staff even before the brexit vote, are you saying that since the vote NHS staff have returned back to there country? Or that due to the population increasing at a faster rate than the NaHS are able to recruit staff that there is now an even bigger shortage?
With regards to the pound, I’m probably in a better posit than most to comment on this due to the companies I own. If you look at the value of the pound two days before the referendum it is not far of parity with what it is now,if however you look at the value of the pound and I’ll thrown in the value of the ftse on the evening of the referendum then both are considerably under this was due to the markets inflating the values on that day and then shortselling the next day.
The truth is John personally I think we will have a tough ride after brexit if it happens in its correct form(this I doubt will happen, personally I think we will get a very watered down version) but this I believe is the point remainders are missing we didn’t vote for a better economy , we voted for a better way of life and to be able to make decisions for ourself, not by some unelected body that we can’t control
posted by Snowflake tormentor (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:37 AM
To say "that's what happens when you give people who don't know what they're voting for a vote", suggests that the comment only relates to those of us that voted leave and not the "remainers".Is this not displaying a somewhat condescending superiority?
posted by bumble (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:43 AM
Couldn’t agree more Bumble, they can’t debate and have this superiority complex, I’m right your wrong head in the sand attitude and can’t or won’t listen to any other views.
I’m happy to listen to other people’s views and I’m happy for my olio. To change if I can see a valid reason for doing so, yet remainers heads are so far stuck in there Guardian whilst eating there humous they can’t see the wood for the trees.
By the way MST I own one of the largest IFA firms in the south east so I’m pretty sure my knowledge of the markets is greater than yours, why business do you own
posted by St (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 9:52 AM
Err, anyone going to the game on Friday? Just thought it would be good to bring it back to Fulham which I thought this message board was generally designed for. But crack on and debate and argue about something that has bored me to tears for the last two years!
posted by Chris of Jokes - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 10:43 AM
St- I have been a commodity broker for 41 years, I own offices in London Holland and Malaysia, and I look on in despair when I travel around the world at what on earth are any benefits from this fiasco for generations to com.
posted by Keetch54 - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 11:05 AM
Ok so we are going down the my dick is bigger than your dick are we ST? You have no idea of my background, knowledge on the subject or my connections so please don't make uninformed accusations.
Just when I thought we were having a serious debate. Shame :0(.
Bumble, please kindly don't make assumptions either. My remarks to having a referendum regarding such a serious subject that affects millions of lives for many years to come refers to the stupidity of asking the public to decide and that refers to both Brexiteers and Remainers.
If you had the same referendum today the results could well be the same and they could well be different but the dynamic of the electorate has changed massively in 30 months so it is unlikely the result would replicate the previous one.
Many older people will be dead or not able to vote and many younger people would now be eligible to vote so how can it be sensible to ask the man in the street with (in general) little or no fact (whether researched or not) but a mountain of rhetoric on one specific day to decide the destiny of an entire nation and then act on a result that was (more or less) 50/50 give or take a few thousand votes in the odd 30,000,000.
My last comment on this particular thread but an interesting debate nonetheless.
posted by MST (Moderator) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 11:51 AM
Shame on you MST, you should stoop so low especially as the moderator
posted by ST (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 12:07 PM
So Keetch 41 years very impressive since commodities or ETC were only regulated in 2003 , or do you mean Swaps?
posted by ST (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 12:11 PM
Agricultural- therefore your assumption shows a lack of understanding of the broader nature of commodities.
Not everything is bought and sold on a tv screen.
posted by Keetch54 - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 12:46 PM
ST - tut and rolled eyes. Another lack of understanding of what a moderator does on this board does. Still, as long as you’re happy....
posted by MST (Moderator) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 1:35 PM
The electorate chose to free barrabas instead of jc.
posted by T.NO (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 2:15 PM
Mst and others. You are still after all this time still missing the point. As to what fifty million people vote to get OUT.Its got nothing to with money shares etc. Its our way of life how We speak the way we are. MST and others you are like the politicians you have not read the warning signs. To what the people were thinking . Mst you say people voted to leave didnt have a clue to what it was all about . Neither did the politicans to what people were saying or thinking. They caused this problem not us
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 3:14 PM
Keetch you said you were a commodities trader in reply to me working in the finance industry, selling agricultural equipment or supplies is not commodities trading in the exchange!
MST I have a rough idea what being a moderator does very similar to bersco in parliament you let people speak only when it’s the same opinion as yours!!
Geezer I couldn’t I said it better myself, u voted for w way of life and for my children and there children to be safe, and for those of you still looking through your rose spectacles get your head from out of your backside before it’s to late.
posted by ST (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 3:28 PM
ST- Once and for all I trade cargoes of vegetable oils ( Substantial volumes at a time ) from origin to destinations world wide flat priced and not on an exchange.
Geddit?
posted by Keetch54 - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 3:57 PM
In the 1975 referendum I voted to leave the Common Market (EU). Prior to the referendum, both Enoch Powell (political right) and Tony Benn (political left) said the aim of the Common Market was to create a political government for Europe and that if we stayed in the Market we would live to regret it in later years. On this issue they were both right.
posted by Bumble (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 4:12 PM
Of course I get it Keetch that’s why I questioned what you put Geddit;-)
posted by ST (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 4:27 PM
So I’m guessing you sell palm oil Keetch?
posted by ST (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 4:28 PM
MST' i think we will eventually be in a powerful position concerning trade deals. We are probably the 5th most powerful country and the most influential in the world. Any lost trade deals can be renegotiated again, who wouldn't want to deal with Great Britain? The car industry has had a good run now for 100 years plus on Deisel oil, everything is in transition now with electric cars creeping in and driverless cars. We don't see things until it is in our faces and not just blaming the likes of Land-Rover who are a bit slow off the mark. We also have big problems with our roads, i don't think we will be ready for self-driving cars ect. Our Roman friends left us with too many windey roads all over the place and it will cost billions to re-design and just to get everything with technology into place. Back to Honda who promised to stay put here? They should not have made that promise and for good reason. Honda and the Japs are so far ahead in technology, but that techno gear and ideas are back in Japan. Technology is developing at a rate of knots and everybody is catching a breath to keep up with it. I challenge anybody to get a workforce of say 2000 people and machinery up to speed with electric technology? Not possible, and there needs to be a lot of thought and thinking hours at the table before any new production on electrics. Boris Johnson had the right idea bringing Electric bikes forward but we are still not up to speed with those fly-over bypasses etc.
We are thinking about all these technology but still not proactive enough to change things. One guy i was reading about today has just invented a Battery that can run for 3000 miles before a charge, can you imagine that? I think they have incorporated it with Hydrogen which is very volotile and dangerous. The guy must be a genius because there is only a prototype for Hydrogen technology but there is still a danger with that stuff. The boffins and clever people like your Teslas who are pushing this stuff are funded generously. We have some clever people here too but they need lots of money and thinking time to bring it to the table. We are just not at the races at the moment, but we are Britain and i think that everybody will eventually want to do business with us again.
posted by OWEN (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 6:02 PM
Owen sorry i have to disagree with the start of your post. We are not powerful any more We are a third rate nation that lives on memories about our past
[.except the snowflakes.] WE could not organise a kiddies christmas party. There is no such thing as a GREAT BRITIAN anymore.
posted by GEEZER (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 7:55 PM
MST has it spot on..FYI GB represents about 1.15% of the world GDP and we are now 7th/8th in terms of economy..we were 5th before brexit but Califiornis is now bigger than us..so anyone who thinks we are Great is harping back to an empire many years ago (built on invading other countries taking there goods and using their cheap/slavery labour)..the reason we are great now is because we (I thought) learnt from that and realised inclusiveness and sharing ideas/culture /people etc is for good not bad..Anyone who says WTO works needs to read up on it as we are bound by pretty strong rules as is everyone else and doesnt make good reading if we go down that path..so imagine why would any nation want to give us a better trade deal with a consumer market of 60m than say the EU with a market of 600m people..SO economically it was always a stupid idea and sadly its divided a nation through nationalism and scaremongering. Nationalism is a forerunner to facism and as someone said its a reason to hate people you dont know...Cameron May Rees Mogg and now Corbyn have a lot to answer for IMO
posted by DT (Guest) - Tuesday 19th February 2019, 8:44 PM